Runt of Litter?

[ErikaJane]

I bought a purebred Pyr pup a couple days ago. He was VERY small and had only one dew claw on each back leg. She assured me that sometimes that happens with Pyrs and said she's been raising them for 15 years. The lady I bought him from also had Saint Bernard/Pyr pups but apparently he was the last purebred Pyr... I weighed him yesterday and he was only 5.3 pounds at 6 weeks. He was a little skinny. I've been feeding him some goat's milk and Wellness wet food and he devours both! She said she gave him his first round of shots and I've been checking his poop for worms but nothing so far. He's a great pup though! Playful, cuddly and kinda loud and mouthy First vet check next week. I just didn't know if he was the "runt" because I know pups his age are pretty big. I saw the parents in pictures and never saw the rest of the litter.

Here is a link to some of his pics...

http://sweetgab.com/photo/

[TexasKat]

What a cutie pie!

6 weeks is awfully young for the breeder to let go of the pups. It's not just about weight/health but you'll find that their socialization skills (specifically nipping) aren't quite as well developed.

In any case, our Gypsy was the smallest of the litter as well. Whether she was the 'runt' or not is unknown, but I believe that she was crowded out of the food and momma when she was tiny. Her attitude (when we brought her home at 9 weeks) was very defensive compared to our more outgoing pup when it came to mealtime (tucked tail, rapid (not casual) eating).

Her whole eating posture said "I have to finish this before someone snatches it away."

It took a few days for her to get comfortable with mealtime and longer for her growth rate to catch up. But she's a happy, healthy girl now with a beautiful coat and a very loving disposition. She's gotten over any anxiety she had about mealtime long ago.

I do believe lack of good nutrition in those first couple of months had something to do with her being a bit 'short'. She's about 25 inches at the withers and standard females are an inch or so taller.

It sounds like you're doing well. You might consider tapering off the goat's milk. Excess calcium can cause Pyr pups to grow too fast (they don't get taller than they will otherwise, they're just reach their maximum height faster). You don't want to 'force' growth on a breed like a Pyr -- it can cause bone and joint problems later.

[Espinay]

Agree 6 weeks is really too young for a pup to be leaving the litter (most responsible breeders will not home pups until at least 8 weeks and here it is against our code of ethics to do so). 6 to 8 weeks is an important period in a pups learning as it is the time they learn things such as bite inhibition and social skills. Evidence shows that pups taken away from the litter too early can have issues later with poor social skills, biting and agression. Now that you have the pup though, it will be important for you to do some work to lessen the chance of this occurring. Read up on articles about raising a 'singleton' litter as these may help.

When it comes to being a 'runt', that is an often misused word. In any litter there are likely to be some pups that are smaller than others in the beginning. This may be due to how and where they implanted as an egg in the uterine horn. Puppies further back in the uterine horns are often smaller than those further up in the 'prime' positions. Being smaller in the beginning is not often an indication that the pup will be small when it is fully grown. Sometimes the smallest end up the largest! Sometimes a pup will be smaller too as a result of medical issues. You can usually tell the pups that are small due to health from the ones that are just smaller but healthy though.

Looking at the pictures your pup does not actually look that small for a 6 week old pup. Remember to grow your pup slow and lean - MUCH better for growing bones and joints! Your pup will reach the size it is meant to be and much better to get there slowly rather than cause problems through OVER nutrition (which is actually more common these days than under nutrition).

Texaskat, 25inches is actually not uncommon - I have met a number of pyrs that height particularly in the US. I would think it unlikely that the pups growth was stunted through lack of nutrition for the first 8 weeks or so, unless it really was a sickly pup when you got it?

[Davey Benson]

I would like to chime in.... follow worming recomendations. Checking stool for worms will only detect those type found there. There are other parasites that don't show up in stool samples. (heart worms, renal worms, eye worms, and whip worms for example)

Good luck with your new young pup.

[TexasKat]

Nope, Gypsy wasn't sickly at all, not counting fleas etc from being born in a barn/goat enclosure. She did have a pretty scraggly looking coat that took some time to get as fluffy as Scout's (who is only a week older and was much larger and fluffier in comparison).

Even though growth rates are pretty individualistic, the difference between my two was pretty dramatic. When they were six months old, Gypsy was just a little bigger than half Scout's size (even though she was just a week younger). He looked 'typically' six months old--- she looked like she was only about 3-4 months old. She did catch up in later months and isn't terribly short -- just a little more petite than other Pyrs we've met.

Having a lower center of gravity, she's harder to manage than Scout on a walk (he's taller and heavier) if she decides she wants to get somewhere special (taking me with her).

On edit: Gypsy was one of a litter of 11.

Here's a pic of Gypsy at 6 weeks at the breeders

[ErikaJane]

Thanks for the replies! He is a handful...loves to play and gets WAY too much attention from people passing by already I feel he's growing by the minute. He seems to do well on his food combo. I've been mixing his Taste of the Wild and Wellness wet food with TOTW dry food and add a touch of goats milk. I'll give him a little more goats milk on the side sometimes since its his fave.

Also, going to the vet tomorrow for the first time! She wasn't a huge fan of feeding raw food to our dogs but my aunt has raised happy, healthy dogs for years on raw venison. Her dogs love it and look amazing (she raised labs and Pyrs). My parents have a cow in their freezer we feed to the dogs. Read some other posts for and against it, mainly running across promotion of raw foods using precautions... Is it too early to start feeding him tiny bits of raw meat?

[Maggie's mom]

Is it too early to start feeding him tiny bits of raw meat?

I switched Arlo to raw when we got him at 9 wks. He did great with his first chicken wing...chomped it right down. Then he got tetanus and ended up with a feeding tube. After the feeding tube was pulled, I used ground raw/bone mixes for a week which he loved. That may be a good way to start your little guy on raw if you want. Now (at 13 wks), Arlo's eating RMB's with no problem...chicken parts and softer pork ribs (more cartilage than bone it looks like.) I don't use beef bones as food, but chunks of boneless meat are great. I give my guys beef ribs, but mainly as recreational bones which I take away if they start breaking off sharp pieces. Some dogs do okay with beef ribs, but I prefer other RMB's as food.
I think Espinay weans her puppies onto a raw diet.

[Espinay]

I feed raw to all my dogs. In fact I brought a 10 week old puppy home to live with me on the weekend and she was switched straight to a raw diet. Eating chicken necks and chewing on a beef brisket bone during the day without issue. There is info on my website about how we feed our dogs with lots of links to more info (look under 'about us' - you will see a page on feeding our dogs).