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  1. #11
    Old Dawg (Senior Member) Antonia's Avatar

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    I would go with your gut feeling on this one and don't let someone try to convince you she is resource guarding. I have a master resource guarder and yes, it gets worse when he is sick but it doesn't come with the flip of a switch out of the blue, with a weight loss of 20 pounds and refusal to eat. I hope they can get to the bottom of this soon!

  2. #12
    Old Dawg (Senior Member) Jewel's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tamiam11 View Post
    That will be next. Ultra sound was mentioned. They want to rule out some other things first and get a second blood panel. All numbers were perfect except eocinaphils.
    If it were me, I would radiograph and ultrasound now. Vets often dink around with trying this drug, try that drug, hoping one might work. It's not helping the dog if those drugs aren't the right ones. Continue with the blood tests but I would want to know what might be going on inside and thus at least the radiograph and if that's inconclusive, ultrasound. I speak from lessons learned the hard way. I can tell you one instance where I asked for radiograph and the vet was doubtful that the radiograph would show anything at all. I insisted and the radiographs showed the problem clear as day.

    I too can't buy into it's just simply resource guarding. Not taking into account everything. The bird attack(s) undoubtedly was traumatic, but it doesn't seem like it would cause all the other issues, doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense the that the bird attack suddenly turned her into a resource guarder.

    Right now I think it's better to just manage her reactivity by avoiding the reaction triggers. If she's suffering from a medical condition, she doesn't need the additional stress of training, no matter how gentle you might think your technique is.

  3. #13
    Young Dawg (Member)

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    Thank you! I feel like I am going crazy. I have always tried to be humble, but I know some things about dogs. I have been blessed to learn from some super amazing educated people. Do you suggest radiograph first? Lungs stomach where? Where to start? Or do ultra sound? What is good point of origin? Do I wait for second blood panel and weight check? I no longer trust myself. I also don't want to be giving "cough syrup for pneumonia" thank you for your thoughts and time❤️

  4. #14
    Young Dawg (Member)

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    Thank you! It is a gut feeling. The term I was looking for. I guess because I have never had a resource guarding issue like this, I feel less educated about it. To me it's a symptom. Hands on is the best way to learn I say. Maybe folks could help if this continues to be an issue. Right now I am maintaining her separately. She is still super sweet and I feel like I'm punishing her but I don't want to make matters worse forcing the other dogs on her. I can be patient with that. Thank you for the thoughts and your time❤️

  5. #15
    Young Dawg (Member)

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    I would ask then, what do you do to control the resource guarding since you have a master? Is dog separated from others? I know all resources get taken up and dealt out separately. Does he human resource guard you? What would this look like? How about leaning on human? You allow that? Your insights, when you have time could be helpful. Thank you!

  6. #16
    Old Dawg (Senior Member) Antonia's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tamiam11 View Post
    I would ask then, what do you do to control the resource guarding since you have a master? Is dog separated from others? I know all resources get taken up and dealt out separately. Does he human resource guard you? What would this look like? How about leaning on human? You allow that? Your insights, when you have time could be helpful. Thank you!
    My boy is handled very carefully and is separated at key times. He is removed from the other dogs well before meal time since this is a trigger. I am also a trigger (as well as a couple other favorite people) so this is a bit more tricky. He is ok if there is a lot of space around him and we are getting ready to go for a walk. It means he's in a great mood, thinking happy thoughts about "walkies", etc. However, inside, he is very reactive. I have walk through baby gates in all the rooms where I have the dogs and have areas where each dog can be without concerns about altercations. My dogs are working dogs but are inside in the daytime during the summer when it is hot. Feeding is done separately and while I can feed small treats that are eaten immediately, I never feed long-lasting treats or bones to any of the dogs unless they are all separated.

    Funny you should bring up leaning because he loves to lean on me, as do the other three dogs. I only allow it with my boy in some settings. If it's just us, he can lean all he wants. If the four dogs are with me in the yard, no leaning and I move away from him if I see him walking towards me with that look in his eye. He knows that if I tell him "not now" and move away, it means I have no intention of making myself an object to be guarded and will keep moving away from him until he desists.

    I've put a tremendous amount of work into training my dogs. All are LGDs but even the 8 month old is getting really solid about her "stay" command, sitting at a distance, waiting to go through doorways until released by name, etc. Training all the dogs helps me immensely in managing my boy. If my boy is in a reactive condition, I can give the girls a command to wait of not approach and they will obey until I can get things under control. I spend a lot of time managing circumstances so as to not trigger a situation where his resource guarding will be triggered. The times it happens and we have a spat, are almost exclusively when I am tired and not as on top of things as usual. He picks up on it and usually takes advantage of it. So, now when I am not at my best, I take someone with me to help distract or manage things when I know he might be cranky or hypersensitive. I have 3 kennels in my large back yard so I have safe places for any dog that is sick, injured or where they can be safely kept if I don't want a four dogs romping match going on when I am not present. This generally means my boy and my older Pyr girl are kenneled and the two younger girls are free when I am not there and it is a time of day when they could get into trouble, generally the morning before 8:00 a.m. After that it is too hot for anyone to want to do much!

    Not sure this is helpful but its a partial picture of how I manage things. Could not live without my boy but he sure does create the need for a lot of fancy footwork and management to keep his evil side under wraps!

  7. #17
    Young Dawg (Member)

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    This was very, very helpful. It is the exact picture I would have in my head and the things I am doing. So now I know I am not that big of an idiot. Lol Yes, they can be capitalists for sure. It is just I have never had to manage something like this. I keep Lonni separate for now until second blood panel comes in. She sleeps in our room at night. The 9 month old Pyr (Clyde Lewis)stays with Luna Bean, the five year old pointer. She comes in when he gets too rough playing with her as she corrects him. That is fine, but I am careful to manage this and have Clyde "move along" because that is last thing I need is these two fighting. I switch Luna and Clyde to yard, Lonni in kitchen and the Cur, Nola is in living room or my sons room. She came to me extremely aggressive and biting everything and everyone. They are an aggressive, noisy breed anyways. She was being taken to be put down and my son was working next door( we own landscaping business) and heard fuss. Dog was going ballistic . He went to see what the problem was and when man told my son, he said put her in my truck, Im done for the day. Between her and the fosters, this is how I learned to manage the troubled dogs. Nola was extremely sick with heartworm! I treated her and we all worked with her. She passes civily and sometimes asks to play with Luna for a few minutes. She is small at 30 pounds and has manners now so she moves well around the house. Lonni and her sniff and go on. I also suspect abuse on Nolas part so I am careful to contain her as she is a fear biter I suspect. She never bit us. She tried. After she was feeling better, we trained her. She hates strangers but goes to her cot and we dont get them often. Her breed hates strangers too. She is a good little girl now. No aggression showed to Nola from Lonni. Just Luna and Clyde. The ones closest to her? I do not let her lean as I dont want to encourage any unwanted behavior in case she is resource guarding me. She is fed separately (free fed in our bedroom so there is nothing to "guard" on her travels through house. Plus she is on special diet to pack weight on her. Clyde doesnt need it because he is a "the cracken" already. Lonni doesnt feel well so do you suppose she knows she may be the weakest of the pack now? She is being medicated (Trazadone) and I do see a difference with fidgety anxiety being better.No wild looking around as if something is going to get her Her appetite is starting to get a bit better too. She is on meds for that and a antihistamine to clear eocinaphils. She plays with me exclusively and some with the others. Last night while passing through, she and Clyde sniffed and I moved them along. No aggression or maybe not enough time for it. I brush her and she is fine. No sore spots that vet or I can find. She takes her medicine well. I am not sure how long to keep her separated and how to reintroduce. It has been going on 3 weeks now. Though of walking in yard with harnesses on. She went after Luna first. Older spayed female? Luna still trying to nurture which turns into control? Clyde just plain pissed her off because he doesnt get the hint. She went from "making him listen" to lunging after him in one hour and it scared him. He went to cot on his own looking behind to see if she was giving chase. He doesnt understand as he still a goofy puppy. I love them all and wish they could all go back to being together and enjoying each others company. Lonni would even interfere with Clydes training. She would come around and gently nip or try to push us away from Clyde when he was being trained or chastised. She hated seeing him in "trouble" She wanted his harness off when we were trying to leash train him even. I want to be careful with Clyde. He is going to be 200 pounds I am sure. I donty want him learning any bad behaviors. I am sure he will those on his own. Lol Right now I think I am managing the best I can. If you or anyone else has ideas or suggestions, I would so appreciate it. Thank you for taking the time to reply and give me the idea of what you do. I know I am on the right track. I love my animals so much and they bring such joy. I want to do the best for them

  8. #18
    Young Dawg (Member)

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    Red face Sudden overnight aggression to pack mates

    Wanted to thank those who responded and for their helpful words. I am please to report Lonni has gained 8 pounds in 12 days. We still have more to go. What a job! She is still on her medicines. They are helping. Still no aggression to humans or other animals. She seems to feel a bit better as well. She is still separated from Clyde and Luna but passes nicely. She approaches Clyde and sniffs and I move her along. Luna stays on her cot as she is older female. Luna is not an aggressor but I want to be careful as Luna nurtured Lonni as a puppy. I dont want Luna to be a trigger. Lonni sees Luna but does not react. I will keep her separated with brief meetings in passing until Lonni's second blood panel comes due. She behaved perfect at vets office. Eyes straight ahead ignoring the loud barking dogs. She made her way to scale and sat perfectly. She then made her way to counter and politely asked for a treat. The nurses love her so much! She waited patiently and a few folks petted her nicely remarking what a big pretty girl she was. Plenty of praise and treat treats for her. Next to store for a purchase. Thank God she also did beautifully. So very proud of my girl. It seems like its taking forever, but I think she is on the mend. I hope and pray she will be able to join the other 2 dogs again as they miss her and at times, she acts like she wants out with them to play. Her clients miss her visits immensely but have prayed for her and wished her a speedy recovery. They are truly wonderful folks and Lonni misses them I am sure. Folks at work miss her and so do our customers. It is good to know so many love her and wish her well. It has been so helpful. Everyone have a good night and much love to all your "great whites" Many thanks- Tami

  9. #19
    Young Dawg (Member)

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    Haha..Fancy foot work indeed. You never said anything about being a magician! Dogs appearing and disappearing where there and arent supposed to be. Oh my!

  10. #20
    Young Dawg (Member)

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    Great Pyrenees have personalities and to that degree are predictable. We have an 8 year old 68 pound Golden Retriever who is an Alpha Wannabe and can be a real pain with his constant growling at the Pyrs and the cats, which never turns into aggression. Our 3 1/2 year old rescue female we have had since she was 2, and yes, she has calmed down since maturing and is more obedient. She still has food aggression. The 18 month old male is impulsive, like a human teenager and we watch him closely. He does know how powerful he is. The dogs are fed out of sight of each other as both Pyrs have food aggression and this works. One of us watches until they are done and go outside. A strong command keeps them out of sight of one another, if one intrudes while the other is eating. When the Golden is outside at the glass patio door, Achilles, our young male goes ballistic, as if he is an intruder. We cannot let the Golden in or there will be a fight. Our Pyrs do run at night and guard the property so this wariness of intruders is natural. We are avoiding bringing other dogs onto the property. The Pyrs rush to any person coming through the gate, but are welcoming. We do not fear any problem with people. I do not see nastiness as the cause of aggression. I think it is more the threat assessment, guarding instinct. Two dead possums in the last couple of weeks, coming over the fence to get my wife's chickens. The Pyrs really want to get at a coyote but the fence prevents that. The Pyrs tolerate the Golden Retriever except when he crosses certain lines, and we know what they are. The Pyrs do see him as being different. The Golden with all his growling does not help things and I am amazed this does not trigger a response. The Golden has never been hurt. Mitigating aggression is about all we can do, changing the dog's threat assessment instinct is not in the cards.

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