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Thread: Barking

  1. #1
    Young Dawg (Member)

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    Hey guys,

    As some of you may know, when I adopted remy he was very young and I knew nothing about pyrs. I was naive and told he was a golden retriever, a breed I grew up with and am comfortable with. Its been a learning experience for me and I'm trying everything I can to make it work.

    Recently, remy has began barking more and more. He is an inside dog, though i do take him out frequently for walks and play time- he is never outdoors alone because i do not have a fenced in yard at this time. Right now he is about 6 months, and his barking is somewhat bearable, but I am wondering if it will get worse from here? Does him being an inside dog help at all? The reason for his barking seems to be attention related right now- for example, if I am in bed he will sit there and look at me and start barking, but will stop if i get on the floor to play with him.

    Like I said, I'm just trying to learn as much as I can to avoid giving him up because that would break my heart. Any help/advice would be appreciated!

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    Old Dawg (Senior Member) snow0160's Avatar

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    Haha it is just like Kit. They will move from attention related to sassing or alert barking. Our dog is also an indoor dog and she barks because she wants to go outside. I don't think being indoor or outdoor changes the barking issue. I used to crate Kit but she would bark nonstop so now she is practically never crated other than her food. She enjoys the crate if there is a treat like yak cheese or filled kong toy. She barks a lot less than she did as a young puppy at a little over a year. I think it is mostly because we gave up on the crate.

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    Young Dawg (Member)

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    Quote Originally Posted by snow0160 View Post
    Haha it is just like Kit. They will move from attention related to sassing or alert barking. Our dog is also an indoor dog and she barks because she wants to go outside. I don't think being indoor or outdoor changes the barking issue. I used to crate Kit but she would bark nonstop so now she is practically never crated other than her food. She enjoys the crate if there is a treat like yak cheese or filled kong toy. She barks a lot less than she did as a young puppy at a little over a year. I think it is mostly because we gave up on the crate.
    Right now remy is crated for a few hours during the day while we are not home, but sleeps out on his bed at night. He usually will start barking around 6am to be let outside and then when I go upstairs to get ready he starts barking again. I'm just so lost and having a hard time finding the advice I need online because I truly did not even know this breed existed when I first got him, which explains why I made the mistake. I dont want to be in trouble with my neighbors and can't deal with the excessive barking for my own sanity. I really dont want to give him up

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    Old Dawg (Senior Member) mikelg84's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by remysmomma View Post
    Right now remy is crated for a few hours during the day while we are not home, but sleeps out on his bed at night. He usually will start barking around 6am to be let outside and then when I go upstairs to get ready he starts barking again. I'm just so lost and having a hard time finding the advice I need online because I truly did not even know this breed existed when I first got him, which explains why I made the mistake. I dont want to be in trouble with my neighbors and can't deal with the excessive barking for my own sanity. I really dont want to give him up
    My dog's barking problem got worse after she reached 6 months old, but I must say that my dog never barked for attention and she still doesn't. From what you said, your dog's barking problem seems to be attention related right now. Puppies are less independent than grown up dogs, so if you are wondering if it is going to get worse, my answer would be: no. This type of barking "shouldn't" get worse in the future.

    BUT,

    As you know now, (it's unfortunate that you didn't know this breed when you got him), pyr bark a lot, especially during the adolescence and when they reach maturity.

    So, there are several types of barking. Let's put it that way. The attention related barking that you seem to be experiencing right now (the "mom, wake up, I want to play, eat, go for a walk"kind of bark) and the guarding type of bark.

    I have come to realization that my dog has to bark. It's in her DNA. She wants to protect my house and my family. For this reason I believe that getting mad at her for barking is usless. Would you have blamed your mom for being worried when you were out with friends? Humans can talk. Dogs prefer to bark.

    My advice for the second type of barking is bonding with your dog and try to create a trust worthy relationship so when he barks, you can calm him down because there is nothing to worry.

    It's not easy, and it might not even work, but that is exactly what we are working on right now. When my dog barks is because she has heard something outside that might be alarming. What I do is take her outside so she realizes what the noise is. If the barking is extreme, I take her for a walk around the block no matter what time it is. She hates the wind and she barks every-time it's windy, but somehow when she is outside and she feels the wind it's like she understands what's going on outside and she calms down and she's good for many hours. If a dog approaches the house she tends to bark (unless it's one of the neighbors dogs, then she is fine). She barks to tell me that there is a dog around the house. - "Can I see if the dog is still there? Has the dog messed up the house? Has the dog taken my stuff from the yard?" - that's what she's thinking.
    So, I take her outside and she sees nothing is going on. We go back inside. She's happy for the rest of the day. And here is the beauty of this. Now, she has been trusting my words a lot more than before. And it might sound weird, but she has started to trust the "it's okay Pippa, there is no one here. Thank you for letting me know. No need to bark" quote that I use over and over again.

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    Old Dawg (Senior Member) nick's spirit's Avatar

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    remysmomma....seems like Remy has been barking for attention since you got him, looking back on your previous posts....

    are you exercising him?
    keeping him stimulated with a Kong or similar puzzle toy?
    how much time do the two of you spend together...bonding...getting him to trust you & your judgement?

    so, he's figured out...bark at Mom & she will play with me....smart boy!

    you need to turn that around...quiet boy will get Mom to play...

    try making him sit....usually they quiet down when they preform one action, it distracts & re-directs attention...then when he's quiet praise & treat & play!!!

    have you read any of the suggested books we keep recommending to others?

    Patricia McConnell

    Dr. Sophia Yin

    both have a world of knowledge to offer....

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    Road Dawg

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    You have received a lot of great information so far.

    My GP mix Judge was an attention barker when he was very little (he is currently only 10 months). He would bark if he was tied up at the campsite, to play, while he was playing (with people, cats or dogs) or if he wanted food/treat/water. Around months his attention barking slowly went away and his alert barking settled in. Currently at 10 months he only attention barks to go out (if we ignore his wine first) and the odd play bark. So in my case it got better with age (and not even a lot of age). However we also taught him the "quiet" command from a young age and reinforced the behavior by giving him treats when he was in a "calm and quiet state" such as on his dog bed relaxing or if he listened to us and did quiet down when asked.

    As for his alert barking we do not mind it at all as we kind of got him not only to be a family dog but also to alert us at night time (he normally sleeps outside by choice) as we have a huge theft problem in the area. So I cant offer you any help there as we LOVE that kind of barking.

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    Old Dawg (Senior Member) SebastiansMom's Avatar

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    Is the attention seeking always when you and Remy are in the same room, or does it get worse when you are in another room?
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    Old Dawg (Senior Member) snow0160's Avatar

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    When Kit was young, she used to whine bark all the time. It is a high pitch yelping. It helps a lot to know the difference between how certain bark sound and what they mean:

    1. Attention barking
    How it sounds: high pitch almost like whining/ yelping
    If you reward attention barking, you might eventually run into a separation anxiety issue where your dog is codependent. If you let her bark it out too much, your neighbor might write you a note the next day. This is hard but you need to find a balance that works for you. Kit had this problem when she was young but ocassiontionally runs into this issue now. She barked mostly for attention and she did it in the following situations: 1. wanting to go outside, 2. wanting to get out of crate, 3. wanting to be lifted off the bed because she was scared, 4. If she is alone in the room and the others were allowed to play, 5. When she wanted the food I was eatting,

    2. Alert Barking
    How it sounds: Intimidating like you'd expect. Deep booming bark. Sometimes starts out with a few deep but soft woof.
    When she sees something out of the norm: 1. strangers who look weird, 2. strange items, 3. motorcycles, gulf carts, moving trucks

    3. Play Bark
    How it sounds: It sounds a lot like attention barking because in the end it is about something she wants. You can tell play bark by looking at her body langauge. Is your pup bowing? Is her tail wagging? Does she have googly eyes?

    4. Aggression Bark
    How it sounds: Similar to Alert barking; however, you need to pay attnetion to body language. You can see raised mane, curled lips, or just simple nastiess.

    From what you've written, it sounds like remy is a young puppy who has a bit of separation anxiety. The breed is vocal but trust me, it is nothing like the excessive barking you'd see with a Pomeranian. I think the attention barking is quite normal for a puppy. I would be worried if your dog is an Alert barker. My last dog was like this, she would bark when she heard any sound outside our home. It would take the slightest trigger and she would go bananas. In my experience, this is the kind of barking situation that is very difficult to fix in Livestock Guardian dogs because it is instinctual.

    My dog Kit is not an Alert barker but more of an attention barker and it got a lot better after 9-10 months. Now she alert barks but very very rarely. She does not bark at the food or postal delivery people. Now at a little over 1 year, she still whine barks at 6am to be let out. She will also bark if she is alone and wants a scratch or for you to feed her.

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    Old Dawg (Senior Member) SebastiansMom's Avatar

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    In my experience, attention barking and Separation Anxiety are two very very very different things. Sebastian attention barks. It sounds a lot like his play bark. Usually, he is trying to get my attention because he wants something. He wants to go outside. He wants a specific toy. He wants cookies. He wants to go hang out in his room. This only happens when I am in the room with him. I respond by ignoring him until he is calm. I will go into another room or hide under a blanket if I have to.

    Sebastian does not have Separation Anxiety.

    Chester, on the other hand, is insanely polite. I am not exaggerating when I say he maybe barks once a week. He alert barks, and will sometimes bark at a squirrel, but does not bark for attention. Chester also has terrible Separation Anxiety that has fortunately responded well to treatment. The barking was only one of many symptoms of Chesterís SA.

    If Remyís ďAttention BarkingĒ only happens when he is in a room by himself, then I think that SA or Isolation Distress could possibly be contributing to the behavior. Isolation Distress is when they donít care who is in the room as long as they arenít alone. Separation Anxiety is when they donít care if there is anyone in the room or not - they are despondent to be separated from someone specific. Both are irrational, anxiety-based sets of behavior that, in reality, are far more than just wanting attention. Chester actually bit through a metal bar on the door of one crate. He mangled most of the other bars on that one. He got a good start bending the bars on a second crate. He has to be crated because a few weeks after he came to live with us, he escaped his crate by collapsing the front panel. He spent the rest of the time I was gone launching himself at the front door. We were in a one bedroom apartment at the time.

    Figuring out the root cause of the barking is the first step to figuring out how to treat it.
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    Old Dawg (Senior Member) Jewel's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by remysmomma View Post
    Right now remy is crated for a few hours during the day while we are not home,
    Do you know if he's barking and screaming the whole time while you're out? If so, then he probably has separation anxiety. If he's fine in his crate, then it is unlikely he has SA. A puppy who does attention barking doesn't mean it has or is going to develop SA. As SebastiansMom said, SA is a irrational condition and you can't mistaken it when a dog has it. My Ren has SA.

    Ren for the most part does not bark to get attention. But when he was much younger (Ren's is 16 months now), he used to bark at me when I prepared his meals, like I just couldn't prepare it fast enough for him. And it was that very annoying high pitched bark snow described. But that went away on its own.

    Do you see a routine of when Remy usually barks? If he's doing that annoying bark in the mornings it's likely because he is full of energy and needs adequate energy outlet. When pups hit 6 months, their energy level goes up a notch or two and they need an outlet for it or they'll drive you crazy.

    My Ren is an only child as well. When Ren was 4 months old, overnight his energy level shot up by 30%. I found I wasn't capable of draining his energy adequately. So I took him to daycare. That made a huge difference in curbing his craziness. When he hit 6 months, there was another overnight spike in energy level. There was no way I could provide the kind of exercise he needed by just walking him. Daycare was critical for my sanity. He's now 16 months and not as crazy bitey. I walk him every morning before I go to work. We go for about 1.5 hours and anywhere between 3-4 miles. Then we come home and he runs a bit around the backyard and then he can settle for the day while we are at work.

    If daycare isn't an option, do you have dog parks around you, or maybe there is an enclosed tennis court or something that you can let Remy safely offleash and do a few zoomies? You can also make a flirt pole that Christi used with her Apollo to great success.

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