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jennmeek
12-06-2009, 04:28 PM
I have a grt pyr and she is 7 months old, she will not leave the chickens & ducks alone, I have had to bring my duck to the vet to get it sewed back up, any suggestions on how to get her to stop trying to eat my birds???

pyr haven
12-06-2009, 06:40 PM
it's sloooow process. I started by introducing the pyrs on leash. depends on how young they are, praise, treats, ignore or gentle reprimand. then i let the pyrs constantly see the animals thru fence like as much as ppossible 247. my baby goose got hurt too but in a play chase so tat made me "volcano" a bit so I sat in the geese pen wit that pyr literally the whole day. It was also about 8mths. Then the male dominance kicks in, and i am still working on easy and gentle and stopping "pyr missile launchers". I think it wud be wise to keep away small animals tat can be hurt easily by those heavy impacts, so i do lock up my old cats and baby geese/chaicken and baby goats.

DPW
12-07-2009, 08:13 AM
I've had little success at training Cider to not chase the chickens. And before the turkeys ended up in the freezer he loved to chase them as well. He knows he's not supposed to. If we're around he's the perfect gentleman around the birds. But when left alone he eventually can't stand it anymore and goes after one.
In our case this behavior seems not to be predatory. In the one year that we've had him Cider has killed two chickens and one turkey. None have been eaten. He "plays" with them. One day I saw him far out in the pasture tossing something up in the air then running around in circles a few times then pick it up and toss it up in the air again. Went to the house and got the binoculars and saw that it was a chicken. Much to Ciders displeasure that dead chicken became his roomate in his pen for two days. That seemed to have helped. He has not killed one since but occasionally I catch him paying more attention to the chickens than I like. Once I caught him pawing at the fence like he was trying to get into the chicken yard.
I believe I read somewhere that the reason many dogs, not just Pyrs, are so interested in fowl is because of their movements. That jerky walking movement triggers a predatory response in the dogs brain and it's off to the races. I have no answer to why Cider decides to play with the chicken once caught instead of dining on it. Maybe all the feathers are just not to his liking.
He was introduced to the chickens when we first got him at 12 weeks old. He showed no interest at all until he reached about 8 months. Now at 14 months he's better but we still have to keep an eye on him.
I agree with Pyr haven. It's a problem that's going to take time to correct. No quick and easy fix for this one that I know of.

pyr haven
12-07-2009, 04:03 PM
i have yet to see if my pyr have prey intention on the fowls. So far it's still play and i have been like a hawk supervising them. The only time time the chase happen is when I am not around, otherwise just like DPW they are perfect. I read somewhere someone hung a chicken feet (leftover from kill) and maybe the smell just turned them off. I had hope goose pen had the same effect we'll see ( as my back is turned they were doing a stand off wit my male cat...life goes on) btw the can of death is great!!!!

ragingbull83
12-10-2009, 04:56 PM
Is your Gp a pure breed or a mix?

Only reason I ask is when I went to Visit my Cus in Southern Mo they have Chickens and goats and everything Mine didnt want to be inside he went out and laid with the live stock untill we left.

Never harmed anything was thinking it might be the age of your Pyr or its mixed up with a lab or something that hunts birds or ducks?

And please mean no offense just saying Ive never heard of a Gp harming something they are suppost to protect could be im wrong and its just because mine was a livestock guard with the Previous owner just hard to picture a full bloded Gp hurting little animals.

I was also thinking maybe you have a fox or something around and its not your Gp?

fluffylove
12-10-2009, 05:17 PM
Pyrs are known to not be good with birds. Lots of work and depending on the temperment it can be done. They were bred to primarily guard sheep, not birds. Keep that in mind.

DPW
12-11-2009, 08:42 AM
ragingbull, remember that for hundreds upon hundreds of years, before Pyr's were even brought to this country, their job was to protect sheep from predators such as wolves and bears. Often the Pyr did this for long periods of time with little or no human intervention. This is one reason Pyr's are so independant to this day. This also meant that Pyr's had to feed themselves. They did this not only by scavenging but by hunting as well. Small mammals and birds were most likely their prey.
As in humans no two Pyrs are the same. Some will never give birds a second glance. Some can easily be trained to leave them alone. And some will take a lot more work.
Also, as you said in your post age is also a factor to consider. I believe an adolescent dog is more apt to push the bounderies of acceptable behavior than an adult.
Assuming that Great Pyrenees in general will not harm any small animal is risking the welfare of any small animal or bird a Pyr owner may come across.

pyr haven
12-11-2009, 04:06 PM
As in humans no two Pyrs are the same. Some will never give birds a second glance. Some can easily be trained to leave them alone. And some will take a lot more work.
Also, as you said in your post age is also a factor to consider. I believe an adolescent dog is more apt to push the bounderies of acceptable behavior than an adult.
Assuming that Great Pyrenees in general will not harm any small animal is risking the welfare of any small animal or bird a Pyr owner may come across.

I been observing my 2 pyr pups. They come form the same litter and is different like night and day. The female loves all animals and will chase only to follow the bro like a game. But I also know the mother has brought back a wild new born piglet for the puppies. Like DPW said, the pyrs guarding the sheep were left days to fend for themselves and come back for kibbles every 2-3 days. Bottomline, it depends on the individual pyr. Besides, they have brains as big as ours, so i know they know they not supposed to. the teen rebellion thing makes sense. I just reinforce daily and try to keep my small animals safe. I cant wait to find out when my pyrs get older...and hope it's just a phase

DPW
12-12-2009, 08:04 AM
"I just reinforce daily and try to keep my small animals safe. I cant wait to find out when my pyrs get older...and hope it's just a phase"


This is what I am doing as well Pyr haven. Thankfully Cider has not been bothering the chickens at all lately. But if I go out with him and the goats and wander around the property and we flush a covey of quail or spook a bunch of ducks on the creek his immediate reaction is to give chase. He stops as soon as I yell at him but he comes back to me wagging his tail, with a very pleased look on his face. Not slinking back with his tail down like he did when I yelled at him for going after a chicken.
Oh how I would love to know what the difference is to him. But to be perfectly honest while sitting here writing this I find myself smiling about it as I remember that I sure was no angel when I was growing up. Karma maybe?

pyr haven
12-12-2009, 04:20 PM
"Thankfully Cider has not been bothering the chickens at all lately. But if I go out with him and the goats and wander around the property and we flush a covey of quail or spook a bunch of ducks on the creek his immediate reaction is to give chase. He stops as soon as I yell at him but he comes back to me wagging his tail, with a very pleased look on his face. Not slinking back with his tail down like he did when I yelled at him for going after a chicken.
Oh how I would love to know what the difference is to him. But to be perfectly honest while sitting here writing this I find myself smiling about it as I remember that I sure was no angel when I was growing up. Karma maybe?

I dun know, but did u grow up to be a well balanced citizen? :p

I think my zoo can sense when we are not exactly disapproving and when we mean serious biz, they also have a sense of humour!

omigosh...I've just been promoted to old dawg!

ragingbull83
12-12-2009, 06:04 PM
Well Dpw I didnt know that guess that im just blessed to have a good Pyr then.
I know they are killers deep down I gave George a Chicken Breast today and he broke it up and ate it like nothen. Cant imagine what his bite force is gotta be incredible.

Mines fed well and he knows that ill take care of him unlike a working Gp that doesnt know where there next meals from is why mine did well with the livestock and working GPs dont.

DPW
12-13-2009, 09:21 AM
Ragingbull, I'm really interested to know where you got the idea that working pyrs "don't know where their next meal comes from." And your belief that working pyr's are not good with livestock.

" mine did well with the livestock and working GPs dont."

And somehow you believe that people with working Pyr's don't care for their dogs?

"Mines fed well and he knows that ill take care of him unlike a working Gp..."

I can't remember when I've read so many inaccurate statements in such a short post. Incredible!
Allow me to introduce a bit of reality to your beliefs about working LGD's.
LGD's are incredibly valuable assets to livestock owners. As such they are exceptionally well cared for. I'll argue that working dogs are in better health than their couch potatoe, city dwelling brethren. I'll also argue that far more Pyr's end up in rescue situations from non livestock owners than from a working environment.
There are always exceptions and I'm sure there are some working dogs that have a rough life. But I know the same is true with suburban and city dogs.
It's not my rural neighbors that are taking unwanted litters of pups into town and abandoning them on the side of the road. The exact opposite is the reality.
Cider is exceptionally well taken care of. Yes, taken care of as well as your dog. And he's got 100 acres of timber, open pastures, rolling hills and a creek for his yard. Cider isn't taken for walks at the end of a leash. He doesn't stand at the door waiting to be let out to go to the bathroom.
Working dogs have the life "pets" dream about.

fluffylove
12-13-2009, 03:26 PM
I totally agree DPW. I have my dogs with many animals, however poulty for some reason they don't do well with. I don't know if it's the quick movement or what.
Do you have any breeders or other LGD owners you can talk to? There is a really really good book about LGD's.


LIVESTOCK PROTECTION DOGS
Selection, Care and Training,
2nd Edition
by Orysia Dawydiak & David Sims

GREAT BOOK. There is a breeder up my way that breeds for LGD's specifically. I could ask her for you?

Tsunibear
12-13-2009, 07:19 PM
I don't work Missy but I do have her interact with all types of animals. She plays with the ferrets, guinea pigs, tortoise, the macaw, cats and her best buddy is the chinchilla who likes to ride her. My friend wants her to meet her goats and bunnies. I know she will be okay with bunnies but the goats I am slightly nervous with. I guess we will see how that goes.

pyr haven
12-13-2009, 10:18 PM
My friend wants her to meet her goats and bunnies. I know she will be okay with bunnies but the goats I am slightly nervous with. I guess we will see how that goes.

Some goats can be very agressive like male lead or mother goat wit young ones. Both my pyrs got intro at 4mths under a controlled situation so tat i know they will learn a goat butt very fast yet not get hurt. It gets easier if the goats are already used to LGD but even then my goats gets kooky now and then and butt

DPW
12-14-2009, 08:30 AM
fluffylove, I do have that book. You mentioned it in a post back when I first discovered this web site. Yes, a great book. In their chapter on the adolescent dog they explain that sometimes it seems the dog just completely forgets what it has been taught about acceptable behavior. And that in most instances they grow out of it. Much like their adolescent human counterparts.
At 14 months Cider is still a young dog. Most of the time I am impressed with his intelligence and of the genetic instinct to protect the goats. But sometimes he shows his "uncooperative" side as well. Yesterday is a perfect example. Forgive me for another Cider story but here goes.
I had not seen Cider or the goats for quite sometime yesterday so I thought I better go find them. Cider found me first then I found the goats. They were munching away on pasture grass and blackberry vines just over the far side of our hill. Cider and the goats began to follow me as I headed back down the hill. After a short time the goats veered off in another direction down hill into a steep and very brushy part of the property. Cider stayed with me.
Not long after the goats were out of site a neighbors dog, a Marremma, Anatolian mix started barking. From up on the hill we can see their farm about 3/4 of a mile away. Cider took off running back up the hill and completely ignored my calls for him to come back. In practically no time at all here comes 27 goats jogging downhill toward me with Cider in the middle of the herd. They all stopped when they got to me and goats started grazing and Cider sat at my feet and leaned into me. Why did a dog barking such a long way off cause Cider to go round up the goats and bring them to me? Although he is a guardian dog and not a herding dog I have seen him round up the goats and bring them to the barn on two other occasions when I guess he felt something was wrong.
So I continue my way back down the hill and Cider takes off again toward the neighbors. Again ignoring me completely. He doesn't stop until he reaches the creek and he's got his nose to the ground running around in the bushes along the creek. He would not come to me. I get to within thirty feet of him and he still would not come to my calls. At ten feet he finally came to me. I didn't want to chance him running off again so I took him by the collar and walked him back to the barn and closed the gate.
In the span of about five minutes he shows an incredible protection instinct by bringing the goats to me because of some perceived threat he felt then takes off running completely ignoring me. Good dog, bad dog. :confused:
Sorry for the length of the post. It's just that I'm pretty proud of Cider, most of the time, and enjoy relating stories of a working Pyr here in the forum. Thank you all for letting me run off at the mouth. And for going completely off topic.

fluffylove
12-14-2009, 09:47 AM
I would be pretty proud of her too. I LOVE watch LGD'S do the work they were bred to do. I want to buy my dog a bunny to guard, he's so good at guarding. we got him a bitch to guard instead, a female pup that is taken to her own.

pyr haven
12-14-2009, 05:08 PM
wat a great dog. wish cider can train my pups! I've too ignored my pups and have been wrong when they perceived a threat. ok so sometimes it's a bird call or something equally threatening.

I'll start a thread called heart-warming stories for xmas and we can all share all these great stories. Just gotta think of one 1st

ragingbull83
12-15-2009, 01:18 PM
Well the one lady said her GP is eating her ducks and Chickens and there other post about GPs are biting people.
Just trying to figure that one out, Because it doesnt seem like thats GP nature.

All are dogs are treated well and ment nothen as a shot at you or any working Gp DP Im sorry if it may have looked like it was put that way. I like everyone here your all good people.