Aggression in adopted adult

[Momlady]

This is my first time here... let me do a quick intro. I adopted Nika (purebred Pyr) when she was 15 months old - she is now 20 months. We are family #4 for her (the breeder, a farm, a family in the city, the pet store for 6 weeks, then us).

My main concern with her is the aggression she has shown. With my hubby, myself, my two older girls (14 and 12) Nika is a wonderful dog with all those "warm and fuzzy" great pyr traits. With my 9 year old daughter and a few visitors to our home, she is not so great.

She:
- is food aggressive ie. growls and snaps when approached while eating or scrounging under the table.
- is dog-dog aggressive... lunging, barking, and whining at other dogs while on a walk (this has improved significantly since we took her to a "step one" class)
- has "soft bit" a child's face... left a red mark but no puncture
- is extremely aggressive when she's gotten into the garbage outside.... snarling, biting, snapping, growling, and generally FREAKING OUT!!

We are working with her constantly and she is incredibly intelligent and learns quickly. She is improving in so many areas.

Here's the big question:

DO YOU THINK THERE IS HOPE FOR REHABILITATION or do you think early euthanasia is inevitable?

I can't have an aggressive dog. We have lots of young children visiting us for extended periods of time (sometimes a week or more) so "leaving her in the kennel" or "putting on a muzzle" are not long-term solutions.

I am hoping she will eventually be a confident, obedient, companion for our whole family.

Any advice?

Lisa

PS She is an inside dog and gets at least one long walk a day and sometimes two as well as time in the fenced backyard to run and play.... although she prefers to just interact with us and not to play alone.

[risestar]

Hello,

First off, YES, there is definately a very good chance at rehabilitation.

It sounds like youhave a pyr that has been poorly trained, poorly socialized and also shuffled from home to home. All of these are bound to cause the problems you describe.

Your resolution require seperating the problems as they need to be dealt with seperately.

#1 - Human dominance- Not good at all, growling, snapping or other signs of aggression towards people is very bad. To resolve it, you will need to establish dominance over the dog, as well as other members of your family. You can do this with a few simple techniques.

The first is the roll over and pin, where you take the dog, flip it over on its back and literally pin it down until it stops squirming. This established dominance over the dog. It may take a few sessions to get it solidified. Also make sure other member of the family do the same so they the dog understands that it is beneath all family members.

Food aggression can quickly be resolved with the above method and also controlling the food, by letting the dog know that you can just as easily take the food away as you give it.

#2 - Socialization - Growling and fear of people is common with a poorly socialized dog. Quite simply, it has been poorly exposed to the world and strange people, kids and other dogs. This will take time, basically taking the dog places where it can interact and see other people, kids and other dogs. Carefully controlling the dog, allow kids to approach and pet it, allowing it to see that it has nothing to fear from other people and if properly done, the dog will learn to enjoy the interactions and walks. All of our dogs bolt top speed to the truck with you tell them its time for a truck ride and walk. They genuinely enjoy it. Socializing an older dog takes a bit longer, but can be done with lots of love, attention and positive reinforcement.

#3 - Obedience - Sounds like some obedience classes will do a world of good. This should be done AFTER you have dealt with the people aggression and made progress in socializing. This will get the dog used to other dogs, people and also help it become a better canine citizen

#4 - Dog aggression - This is common in Pyrs, even well trained and well socialized ones. It can be lessened and controlled, but generally not eliminated. Remember the Pyr has been bred to manage other dogs while in the field and many have an intolerance of strange dogs. This however is mostly a dominance issue as well, once the Pyr has established to the other dog that it is the boss, thats usually the end of the hostilities.

For control, get yourself a good large pinch collar such as the one mentioned on the training information pages. Upon approach of another dog, you will see the dogs body language change. Lift firmly up on the collar and put the dog into a sit position until the other dog passes and praise yours if it does not react to the other dog. With work, most pyrs can be taught to ignore other dogs unless they act aggressively towards it. It can take time and a lot of patience though, depending on the individual dominance of the dog.

See here for some great training info http://www.greatpyr.com/great_pyrenees_training.php

[Momlady]

Risestar,

Thank you for your response to our aggression issues. We have two animal behaviourists coming over in the next week or two to "assess" Nika. I'm hopeful that they will give us more of the practical advice you've already offered.

Quick question about socializing her. When we're out for walks, she's ALWAYS on a lead.... either a 6 foot training lead or sometimes the Flexi-leash. What would you recommend for an off-leash dog approaching Nika? Should we turn and walk the other way, make her sit regardless of the action of the other dog, let her sniff until she snarls? Etc. I'd like to get your input on this. Up until now we pretty much just avoid any other dogs on our walks and I know this isn't going to help Nika get more socialized.

:confused: Oh, one more (sorry) about the Alpha Roll. Should I be concerned that this might make Nika bite one of us? I'm especially concerned about the kids doing it. My 14 year old daughter does this often with her in their wrestling/playing sessions and the dog really does respect my daughter. How do my petite 12 year old and 9 year old do this?

:) The food aggression is coming along nicely. I fed her today with my hand right in her bowl with no sign of aggression. My next step is to work on getting each member of the family to this point then we'll try more "tasty" items than just kibble.

Thanks for all your advice. This board is great!

Lisa

[risestar]

Just be sure to take what the behaviorist says with a grain of salt, there are a lot of such people that are kooks that assign human problems to dogs. Additionally, Pyrs are different from most other breeds and so such a person may give you advice that may work for an normal breed but not yours if they are not familiar with Pyrs and what they were bred to do.

Most canine problems are a little more than a lack of training or socialization, but a lot of kooks out there will charge you a lot for "doggy therapy" which is usually bunk. IMHO, you arent at that stage yet, where you need such a person. Set your dominance, train it, socialize it and if required obedience training and if theres still an issue, thats the time to seek a specialized trainer, depending on the situation, but this is rare if you covered all your bases as far as training and socialization. So listen what they have to say , but dont commit to any expensive sessions or anything until you've completed things on your own



If you have your dog on leash and an unleashed dog approaches, the best you can do is sit yours down and control the best you can. Best if you have a pinch collar and gently lift stright up to remove any slack and hold your dog until the other dog passes. If an fight breaks out, it is the fault of the other owner, not you. If you walk away, you have less control then if the dog is sitting. As you do more, you will get to learn to read your dogs body language and you will have a good idea how your dog will react before the other dog is in range. If the dogs expression and body changes, the other dog has caught its interest, if nothing changes, chances are it has decided that the other dog is uninteresting

For the roll, do it yourself first, roll if and pin it down upside down, with both of your arms on its shoulders, that way you are clear of its mouth. Its fairly rare for a Pyr to want to bite in this situation, most simply want to try and squirm away. Once you master it, the dog will be used to the technique and you can let your other family members do it, making sure you are right there as well. If you need to, just help your daughter hold it down until it stops resisting.

Risestar,

Thank you for your response to our aggression issues. We have two animal behaviourists coming over in the next week or two to "assess" Nika. I'm hopeful that they will give us more of the practical advice you've already offered.

Quick question about socializing her. When we're out for walks, she's ALWAYS on a lead.... either a 6 foot training lead or sometimes the Flexi-leash. What would you recommend for an off-leash dog approaching Nika? Should we turn and walk the other way, make her sit regardless of the action of the other dog, let her sniff until she snarls? Etc. I'd like to get your input on this. Up until now we pretty much just avoid any other dogs on our walks and I know this isn't going to help Nika get more socialized.

:confused: Oh, one more (sorry) about the Alpha Roll. Should I be concerned that this might make Nika bite one of us? I'm especially concerned about the kids doing it. My 14 year old daughter does this often with her in their wrestling/playing sessions and the dog really does respect my daughter. How do my petite 12 year old and 9 year old do this?

:) The food aggression is coming along nicely. I fed her today with my hand right in her bowl with no sign of aggression. My next step is to work on getting each member of the family to this point then we'll try more "tasty" items than just kibble.

Thanks for all your advice. This board is great!

Lisa

[fluffylove]

Be careful with the role over. From my experience it creates a bully and will not work. Done it, and only made it worse. It's ok as a puppy, but as an adult you probably will get bitten. Ours was aggressive with dogs, with food and VERY dominant with us. You can fix her, just not with the behaviorist because they usually do not understand the breed. I have been there and done that and transformed my dominant intact male two year pyr into an obdience master up and coming as well as therapy dog to adults and kids. We have seen and researched just about all that is out there and found one thing that works. IT costs 500 bucks and is guaranteed for the life of the dog. I'm actually looking into getting the training and becoming one because this is the only thing that gets you respect and dominance over a pyr. We've done all the collars, trainers, food, toys, roll overs, hits, and the only problem was, we were not handling our alpha properly. We had a puppy we socialized for the breeder for two days and she was fully trained in what she was allowed to do and not do by us in five minutes. No bolting through the door, not letting her around Niko's food etc. You know, I can now walk my dog, by a fence with a lunging intact large dog and have him submit to me with only a growl. I can also stop him from barking from upstairs in my house with a growl. It can be done, calming, assertively and without touching the dog. Body language, growling and training pillows. I didn't think it was possible but we are living proof! I have seen pyrs all over, we do shows as well, seen the way they handled as well as help take care of my breeders 40 dogs and learn from her 40 years of breeding.
Don't give up, Pyrs are special dogs for a special reason, they really are worth it. Our dog took on fully grown pyrs 120lbs plus at 10 weeks talking back and taking them on. NOt a temperment problem but a true alpha male which by the way there aren't as many as you think. JUST remember, the females are the ones that run the pack, not males.